Counter a hatemonger with love and song : Pittsburgh Indymedia

Counter a hatemonger with love and song
by digital Wednesday, Apr. 16, 2003 at 6:47 PM

Infamous anti-gay preacher attacks Mr. Rogers.

Fred Phelps (of http://www.godhatesfags.com fame) is coming to Pittsburgh on May 3rd to protest a memorial service for Mr. Rogers. How anyone can hate homosexuals is beyond me, but how anyone can hate Mr. Rogers and not be committed to an institution is a complete mystery. I highly encourage everyone to come out with us and sing songs from Mr. Rogers amazing show and help draw the focus away from Phelps mediawhoring and hatemongering towards more positive things.

Mr. Rogers dedicated his entire life to teaching children and I think he deserves better than to have Phelps spewing hatred at those who loved him. Lets drown them out with a positive message.

More info available here:

http://www.thomasmertoncenter.org/calendar/Lists/Events/DispForm.htm?ID=1519&Source=http%3a%2f%2fwww%2ethomasmertoncenter%2eorg%2fcalendar%2f

www.thomasmertoncenter.org/calendar/Lists/Events/DispForm.htm?ID=1519&Source=...

to silence a hatemongerer...
by unnamed Thursday, Apr. 17, 2003 at 3:49 PM

And if that doesn't work, I say we unplug his PA system.

spin the bottle
by RAGer Thursday, Apr. 17, 2003 at 4:03 PM

anyone up for a queer makeout bloc right in front of his fucking face?

RESYST
by branden Thursday, Apr. 17, 2003 at 6:20 PM
pinkbloc@cease.info 412-363-1877 4805 penn ave

RESYST is planning a kiss-in for his tour. If you are interested in queer direct action we welcome new people to our group. For more information about RESYST please visit http://www.thomasmertoncenter.org/RESYST

The page hasn't been updated in awhile because we've all been focusing on the anti-war movement with other groups. If you are interested in knowing when our next meeting is (soon) please email us.

www.1877.org

Making out
by Theo Thursday, Apr. 17, 2003 at 9:44 PM
TheoK444@aol.com

Yeah, making out with someone hot in front of some hate-filled fundamentalist preacher. Twist my arm.

Ignore Him
by George Kanakis Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 12:51 AM

People who are planning to protest are falling right into Mr (sic) Phelps trap. The only thing the man really desires is media exposure. If we simply ignored him, he would get little or no media attention at all. Instead now he will have an opportunity to spread his message via the media, which will be all over him. Then, the homophobic reporter who will invariably be sent to cover the story will write some piece about all the immoral behavior amongst the "queers", complete witha photo of 2 guys kissing. That will be the story in the paper Monday morning, and that ill be the story that pittsburghers will read. Just a bunch of freeks making a commotion again. The net result is that Mr Phelps ends up looking ligitimate, while everyone else looks extremist.

agreed
by . Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 8:28 AM

I think this is the case as well, Phelps has been doing this for years, he wants people to show up and cause a ruckus, so he can get the cameras turned on.

I don't rrecommend ignoring him, but remember that this is a memorial for Mr. Rogers, it shouldn't be turned into a propaganda platform for anyone. I like the idea of countering his words with the songs of Mr. Rogers, but people need to be careful that they don't respond to Phelps with anger, hate, yelling or anything like that or he has gotten what he wants.

in the spirit of Mr. Rogers, I believe that people should go and show Phelps that hate cannot rule, and that even the hateful can be loved.

Please let's not aloow our groups to turn a memorial for a great man into a spectacle.

.
by . Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 9:50 AM

Please, could we keep the pro-gay stuff to a minimum at this thing? This isn't about Phelps' hatred for homosexuals this is about helping to drown out his message of hate so those going to a memorial for Mr. Rogers don't have to see it. So please, let's try to keep it limited to Mr. Rogers related stuff, and leave the kiss-ins for other appearances by Phelps. Going to a Mr. Rogers memorial to scream "we're queer and we're here" is just as inappropriate as going to scream "Mr. Rogers burns in hell with the fags!!!"

Bullshit
by RAGer Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 12:04 PM

What the fuck is up with the comment about keeping "pro-gay" stuff out of this event. Fred Phelps is the fucking KKK of the anti-queer movement and there is absolutely no way to have a counter demonstration to his message without being clear that we disagree with that movement. ARA will be coming up with a statment on the importance of confronting assholes like Phelps and that ignoring them NEVER helps. They want us to stay away and they dont want to be embarrassed and they especially don't want to get their asses kicked. So yea, I will sure as hell be making out right in front of him. This mother fucker protested at Matthew Sheppard's funeral for Christ sake. I think we should all get out there and make him as uncomfortable as possible. Whether that is shit like the ADL planning to sing Mr. Roger's songs (don't get me wrong I love Mr. Rogers but the ADL (they are racist Zionists and they hate ARA) can kiss my ass) or trying to be more in his face we should all be there to counter him. Look, we need to be clear that homophobia (and other related -ists) will not be tolerated here and that every time one of these groups comes to our town we will be out to drown them out/run them out of town. Now I've gotta go counter some anti-choice college kids from Ohio at the Planned Parenthood clinic. See yall there.

Phelps looking mainstream?
by John Lacny Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 12:05 PM

Look, there's simply no way that Phelps could look "mainstream," when he carries around signs that say "Thank God for September 11," and argues that "God used the heathen as his instrument" to smite "Fag America" on that day.

Phelps is indeed "God's gift to [gays and lesbians]," but not at all in the way he thinks he is. Because he is such a raving retro-Calvinist psycho, he objectively aids gays, lesbians and their allies to show the bigots in their true light. Drawing attention to him is EXACTLY the kind of thing we SHOULD do!

my point
by . Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 12:24 PM

I am not against confronting him, and i think he should be, but I also think that the activities of the day (it is a memorial for Fred Rogers) should be conducted in the right light.

If Phelps was just coming to town to do his thing, I'm all for the queer make-out. But I think that he is trying to ruin a memorial service and the activities should keep in line with celebrating Fred Rogers life, when the memorial is over, make out all over him.

Ignore him continued
by George Kanakis Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 12:27 PM

Phelps will never be "uncomfortable", because there will be plenty of cops waving their clubs ready to "protect his 1st amendment rights". I implore you, JUST IGNORE HIM! We all agree that Phelps is awful. It's just not worth it. The Rodgers Family has asked that this not happen. Please respect their wishes.

Diversity of Tactics
by Branden Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 1:00 PM
branden@1877.org

First of all I would like to stress that a large population of the Pittsburgh movement has adopted diversity of tactics. This said, I may believe singing mr. rogers tunes is ineffective for me, but I believe it adds strength in our message.

Secondly, you sound like every typical gay and straight person when you ask us to "please keep the 'fill-in the blank' stuff out of the action". We will not be put on the back shelf anymore. You say we'll look like a bunch of freaks, well that's the point. We aren't "just like everyone else". I am a queer, a freak, and a revolutionary. I won't come down fighting until all people are respected and loved. I fight for civil rights and equality. I focus on class issues. I am a poor queer with a fucking tattoo on my chin and I get more respect for that than you ever will by silencing my kind. This whole society is built on the geeks and subverts that you try and silence. Change isn't met by homogeny and liberation isn't achieved by silence.

We will fight and we will be showing the utmost respect for Fred Rogers. The saying goes: "they came for the jews and I said nothing because I wasn't a jew ...". Wouldn't Mr. Rogers want us to stand up for all of us precisely for that value?

branden
by . Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 1:50 PM

We will not be put on the back shelf anymore.

This isn't about putting you on the back shelf and keeping you down. In fact, this entire event has absolutely ZERO to do with you or the gay movement. This is Mr. Rogers memorial and Fred Phelps is going to try to destroy that. We will stop him, but if we stoop to his level of turning it into a platform for our movement than we have forgotten anything Mr. Rogers has taught us. You say we'll look like a bunch of freaks, well that's the point. We aren't "just like everyone else".

I didn't say that you were freaks. I said having a make-out protest at a Mr. Rogers memorial is inappropriate. This protest isn't about Fred Phelps, it's about Mr. Rogers and it's important we remember that. Phelps' anti-gay message is horrid and vile, but we will drown it out just as well by physically blocking his signs from view and by drowning him out with songs from Mr. Rogers. Having a "kiss-in" is just another form of the "we're queer/we're here" slogan, and has no place at a Mr. Rogers memorial.

So please, leave the chip on your shoulder at home, don't bring your platform, put your movement away for the day, and just help memorialize Mr. Rogers in the best way possible. Phelps is going to protest at many locations around pittsburgh while he's here (his site has info) so feel free to attend any of those and do whatever you want. I'm just asking everyone to please let this be about Mr. Rogers and not Phelps' hatred for homosexuals.

RAGer
by . Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 2:00 PM

Ok, a couple quick points:

1.) Phelps and his crew DO want to get their asses kicked. They are all lawyers and have made quite a living by provoking people to hit them and then suing.

2.) Phelps and family are not embarrassed. They are insanely proud of what they do. They want us to be there, because it will get them more press. Phelps is a huge mediawhore.

3.) WTF does the ADL have to do with this? They didn't organize anything that I know of. But it's nice to see a radical denouncing a rights group. Have you gone so far left you're now right?

Ok, those are my points. Oh yeah, I also feel it's important to point out how ignorant you are, and how pathetic it is you wouldn't even do basic research on someone you hate so much. If it weren't for the fact that he's protesting at a memorial for a man who taught me so much as a child I wouldn't even be going. But as it is I'm going, and now I'm wondering if we won't have to organize a counter-counter protest to hide the crowds of homosexuals making out from the memorial attendees, because it's just as fucking inappropriate as what Phelps is doing.

Have some respect for Mr. Rogers and focus on that May 3rd. Your movement can go on hold for a couple hours.

ADL is not just a rights group
by Defender of Palestine Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 6:21 PM

Don't be so quick to assume that a leftist needs to support what the ADL does.

http://www.fpp.co.uk/docs/ADL/censorsInternet.html is an overview.

You may be interested in pages like http://www.adl.org/Israel/israel_protest_calendar.asp#ev1 which classify anti-war protests as "anti-Israel protests."

http://www.adl.org/main_israel.asp

The first article does sum things up well; the ADL does things everyone can agree on (fight the KKK) to gain legitimacy and then they promote their own pro-Israel agenda.

This is off topic, but it needed to be pointed out.

WHY IS HE PROTESTING MR> ROGERS??
by Defender of Isreal Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 7:10 PM

Why is he picking on Mr. Rogers? Was Mr. Rogers gay? Did Mr. Rogers make someone this guys knows gay? Did Mr. Rogers make this guy Phelps uncomfortable with his own repressed homosexual desires? Did Mr. Rogers reject Mr. Phelps' sexual advances? Does Mr. Phelps wear womens undewear? Would Mr. Phelps like to wear womens underwear? I know I would.

Why is Phelps going to protest Mr. Rogers? I don't see the connection here. Can someone enlighten me. It just doesn't make sense to me that (1) anyone would actually protest Mr. Rogers, and (2) that some nut ball from East Bubblefuck Backwoods America with his anti-gay perversion of Christianity for the purpsoe of protesting Mr. Rogers as somehow being an appropriate object of that twisted interpretation of Christianity.

Why, Oh Why, Is he coming here and not just going to protest WWF for its mass marketing of muscular sweaty men contrting themselves into primal and sexual positions which are broadcast right into the livingrooms of mobile homes all over his neighborhood? It just does not make any sense.

wow
by RAGer Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 8:39 PM

Check those links that defender of Palestine wrote and actually read my fucking comments before you say I am criticizing a "rights" group. As I said earlier the ADL is a Zionist organization. Zionism is a racist fucked up ideology and I would never ever support them. That said, how dare you ask people to not bring sexual orientation into this or any situation. i can only assume you are straight because you see we can't check our personal politics at the door because they are personal see? Fred Phelps is protesting Mr. Rogers because he(Phelps) is anti-queer and you ask us to not bring up our orientation or Phelps's reason for being there? Oh yeah, it is not like it is Mr. Roger's funeral by the way. Not that that makes too much of a difference but I thought I would point that out. And Branden, you're hot and I love your chin tatoo.

DoP
by . Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 8:55 PM

which classify anti-war protests as "anti-Israel protests.

Considering that up until 3 weeks ago Iraq was still helping to fund suicide bombers in Israel I would probably do the same thing.

RAGer
by . Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 9:00 PM

As I said earlier the ADL is a Zionist organization. Zionism is a racist fucked up ideology and I would never ever support them.

OK. So after you develop some reading comprehension skills could you go back, reread my post, and tell me what the ADL has to do with Mr. Rogers and/or Fred Phelps?

That said, how dare you ask people to not bring sexual orientation into this or any situation.

Um...I didn't ask people to not bring their sexual orientation. I'm just pointing out that the Mr. Rogers memorial isn't about the gay rights movement or protesting Phelps' anti-gay ideas. You are selfishly projecting your own platform onto something which should be all about Mr. Rogers and his fanstastic life.

i can only assume you are straight because you see we can't check our personal politics at the door because they are personal see?

I'm not asking you to check your personal politics at the door, I'm asking everyone to lay them aside for a couple hours to show some respect for Mr. Rogers. My mother and I disagree a lot over the war on drugs (she's pro, I'm con) but I let that go when I visit to keep things civil and show some respect for my family. Do you really think a kiss-in is going to make Phelps see the error of his ways? Is it going to do anything other than show the world you don't really care about Mr. Rogers and are just there to promote an agenda?

Fred Phelps is protesting Mr. Rogers because he(Phelps) is anti-queer and you ask us to not bring up our orientation or Phelps's reason for being there?

He's protesting Mr. Rogers because he's a mediawhore and a hatemonger (not just queers.) Bringing up your orientation or Phelps' reason for being there is just feeding his media machine and whoring for your own platform. Have some decency and respect and just celebrate Mr. Rogers life. If we use that to drown out Phelps than we've won. If we sink to his level we've lost.

Oh yeah, it is not like it is Mr. Roger's funeral by the way.

This statement seriously disgusts me, in ways I didn't even know were possible. For just a second I want you to imagine if Fred Phelps were protesting at a memorial for AIDS victims and said the same thing.

no name
by RAGer Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 9:17 PM

Okay dude. Did you read the sentence after the comment about the memorial service? But fuckit that was inapropriate on my part. In response to the ADL stuff I heard that they were involved in organizing the singing of Mr. Roger songs at the service. Could be wrong but fuck you anyway. See, anytime Fred Phelps comes to town it intimately affects teh queer community and this time it is not just about Mr. Rogers. We know Fred's agenda is essentially advocating for the extermination of a shit load of people. And really no name, I would not recommend trying to block us or put us back in the closet. No more of that shit will be tolerated. We will do our best to block Phelp's message and we respect the way you will attempt to do that and we ask that you respect ours as well because we will defend our right to be ourselves at this counter demonstration.

RAGer
by . Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 10:08 PM

In response to the ADL stuff I heard that they were involved in organizing the singing

It is wrong.

Could be wrong but fuck you anyway.

With that attitude I'm surprised you made it past Stonewall.

See, anytime Fred Phelps comes to town it intimately affects teh queer community and this time it is not just about Mr. Rogers.

Sorry, but the memorial service is just about Mr. Rogers. It's why Phelps will be there, it's why I'll be there. I'm just asking we keep it about Mr. Rogers and not turn it into a Phelps bashing festival. He's really too easy of a target anyway.

We know Fred's agenda is essentially advocating for the extermination of a shit load of people.

Technically his agenda is to get himself some more media coverage.

And really no name, I would not recommend trying to block us or put us back in the closet. No more of that shit will be tolerated.

I'm not trying to block you or put you back in the closet for fuck's sake. I'm just tryijng to stress that it is a memorial for Mr. Rogers, not a platform for everyone's agenda. Go watch the Laramie Project for a beautiful example of how to deal with Phelps. Just quietly block him out. Make it so his message isn't heard, his signs aren't seen, and YOUR civility is on full display. That's why I think the counter protest needs to focus on Mr. Rogers and not at all on Phelps (other than to drown him out) and that's why singing is a great way to deal with Phelps. Having a kiss-in is retarded and immature. The day isn't about your sexuality, or someone attacking it. The day is about a kind and wonderful man who taught MILLIONS of kids really amazing things over the course of 50 years. Focus on that and Phelps will naturally fall by the wayside. Focus on Phelps and the day becomes about Phelps and your hatred for him (not the other way around.)

I'm just trying to appeal to everyone's basic sense of humanity and civility. Please, let's keep this just loud enough to drown out Phelps while quiet enough to respect Mr. Rogers.

shout it out
by krystyna Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 10:56 PM

much love RAGer and branden!! - keep ut the good fight

shout it out
by krystyna Friday, Apr. 18, 2003 at 10:57 PM

up the good fight

branden
by decent Saturday, Apr. 19, 2003 at 11:13 AM

I am a poor queer with a fucking tattoo on my chin and I get more respect for that than you ever will by silencing my kind.

So you get respect for something you were born as, for not having any money, and for having a tattoo on your chin? That's pretty shallow and vapid. Respect people for what they do, how hard they work, and their intelligence. Not for their sexuality, their laziness, or their ink.

Off topic: Zionism
by Defender of Palestine Saturday, Apr. 19, 2003 at 2:27 PM

Yes, I'm the same person who posted the links about ADL earlier. I'm also someone who used to post their name here but given recent events has decided to go anonymous.

Zionism is not inherently racist. Zionism is the belief that Jews are a people and are therefore entitled to a state of their own. Whether or not Jews qualify as a nation and not just a religion is a question that's sticky, but no matter what you believe it's not a hateful opinion. Believing that a nation is entitled to a state or should have a state means you buy into the whole nation-state ideology; I disagree with the idea of nation states in practice, so I reject Zionism along these lines (we should be working to blur the lines between nations in states, as no state is fully homogenous)

That being said, Zionism is not racist. Many Zionists are, however, because they support the idea of a Jewish state in Palestine (Israel), yet do not support the rights of the indigenous people to live as equals within this state. This, for a lot of people, leads to racism (we're depriving you of a state because we are more entitled to it than you)

To say that Zionism is racism is to label yourself as reactionary and to not really understand Zionism or racism. It will achieve nothing. While many Zionists (particulary ultra-nationalist ones) are indeed racist, the belief that Jews are a people and are entitled to a state is not inherently racist.

If you would like to continue this conversation elsewhere, post a news story or something, because we are off topic.

Fred Rogers is a man who I respect very much, and I hope that whatever is done at the memorial service best serves his memory, whatever that may be. I also know of no ties between this event and the ADL (nor do I unequivolly condemn the ADL, they do many important things as well. I just acknoweldge they aren't all good, but hey, who is?)

to decent
by s.f.b Saturday, Apr. 19, 2003 at 6:39 PM

"Not for their sexuality, their laziness, or their ink."

-uh, not to be an offensive bitch, but oh well because i am: fuck you for equivilating poor with lazy, asshole.

furthermore, my understanding of why fred phelps is going to be disrupting and disgracing the mr. rogers memorial is because he told children and people that they should be proud of who they are (and being gay or queer or whatever else is okay.) at least that is one thing fred phelps has against mr.rogers, so being queer and visible is relevant in my book.
furthermore, "the movement" should be visible, just because some queers or gays want to have a kiss in doesn't mean it represents the whole movement, it represents a specific group of people who have a statement to make. (and since we have all been reminded oh so fondly of our civil rights, especially through such onlive conversations for example rich mackin, then i say right on.)
some of you people have yr panties on a little to tight i think.
mr. rogers says to be proud of who i am, and i am a radical queer fat bitch who is going to be myslef like my childhood idol told me to by locking lips in front of fred phelps if i wanna.

.
by . Saturday, Apr. 19, 2003 at 7:54 PM

fuck you for equivilating poor with lazy, asshole.

Sorry, that was inappropriate. I shouldn't have been "equivilating" lazy with poor when there are many factors involved. Intelligence, general attitude, and personality will all be factors.

furthermore, my understanding of why fred phelps is going to be disrupting and disgracing the mr. rogers memorial is because he told children and people that they should be proud of who they are

Nope, he's protesting because Mr. Rogers was a member in a church which allows gay members. Check Phelps' website for more info.

furthermore, "the movement" should be visible

Why should "the movement" be visible? The day has nothing to do with the movement and you are just co-opting Mr. Rogers memorial out of selfishness and a blind desire to push your agenda, exactly like Fred Phelps. Congrats, you're on the level of a religious nut!

mr. rogers says to be proud of who i am, and i am a radical queer fat bitch who is going to be myslef like my childhood idol told me to by locking lips in front of fred phelps if i wanna.

That's fine at the ~15 other places Phelps will be protesting in Pittsburgh on May 3rd/4th. But please, keep the memorial focused on Mr. Rogers, not on Phelps or your hatred for him and his message or your retarded assumption that making out in front of Phelps will do anything other than appear inappropriate to all the memorial attendees (not to mention those who will see it on the news.) Don't make the protest at the memorial be about pro-gay/anti-gay, make it about Mr. Rogers and ignore Phelps and his message. That will win us favor with the public and make Phelps look even more silly and uncivilized.

again
by s.f.b Sunday, Apr. 20, 2003 at 6:11 AM

"Nope, he's protesting because Mr. Rogers was a member in a church which allows gay members. Check Phelps' website for more info. "

*uh, the rest of the sentance said that mr.rogers promoted self love, even for gays. one of the reasons phelps hates mr. rogers is that. you are basically saying the same thing in differnt words. so leave the "nope" out of it. i have read phelps website, and this is my perspective, NOT YRS.

---"Why should "the movement" be visible? The day has nothing to do with the movement and you are just co-opting Mr. Rogers memorial out of selfishness and a blind desire to push your agenda, exactly like Fred Phelps. Congrats, you're on the level of a religious nut! "

* do i need to explain this? or is there a mutual level of intellegence where we can understand this without being ridiculous and full of blind heterosexism?
push "my" agenda? WTF.
the day isn't just about mr.rogers, phelps' is protesting other spots in the city too. (check out the site, remember??) it all stems from the issue of sodomy and homosexuality. if yr boy mr.rogers was a gay-hater, phelps would not even give a fuck abt him.
how can you say the day has nothing to do with the movement, when phelps' is coming because mr.rogers supported gays/church that supports gays..

---"That's fine at the ~15 other places Phelps will be protesting in Pittsburgh on May 3rd/4th. But please, keep the memorial focused on Mr. Rogers, not on Phelps or your hatred for him and his message or your retarded assumption that making out in front of Phelps will do anything other than appear inappropriate to all the memorial attendees (not to mention those who will see it on the news.) Don't make the protest at the memorial be about pro-gay/anti-gay, make it about Mr. Rogers and ignore Phelps and his message. That will win us favor with the public and make Phelps look even more silly and uncivilized."

---fyi alert: using the term "retarded" is not cool or okay, it makes you look like an ass.
furthermore, do what you will and some of us will do what we will. it is yr right, our right, and phelps' right.

freshen up yr politics, lose the heterosexism and maybe not even then will i listen to what you have to say. i cannot listen to someone who is intentionally ignorant, it is different when you really don't know. you seem smarter than that.

Other stops he's making
by Sam Sunday, Apr. 20, 2003 at 7:34 PM

Phelps and co. are also picketing at the Post-Gazette and at Chatham later that day, at a bunch of churches the next day, and at Pittsburgh Theological Seminary the following Monday.

wow...
by Erin Monday, Apr. 21, 2003 at 10:51 AM

making out, gay, or STRAIGHT is inappropriate behavior for a MEMORIAL SERVICE.
why are people forgetting this?
the reason for protesting phelps AT THIS ONE LOCATION, is to block HIS inappropriate behavior
it is probably safe to say that everyone attending this memorial does not agree with what phelps is saying, and all they will see him as is a patehtic hate mongoring asshole, there trying to deistract from the point of the memorial service
making out does the same thing (well distracting not hate mongoring)
i doubt you would want people sitting in the back of your mother, or grandfathers funeral making out, or outside there memorial service
and that is exactly what mr rogers is, a grandfather, a father, and a very important friend and relative to many people.
you will have MANY opportunities to makeout in front of phelps, over may 3rd and 4th, make the memorial about silencing him, and respecting those who LOVED Mr. Rogers!!!

Luke 9:60
by Jesus Monday, Apr. 21, 2003 at 11:14 AM

But he said to him, 'Leave the dead to bury their own dead; but as for you, go and proclaim the kingdom of God.'

Personally...
by Sam Monday, Apr. 21, 2003 at 3:29 PM

Out of respect for the family, I'd stay away from the memorial service, but heckle Phelps at the other stops he's making.

Either way, I'll be there to take pictures.

memorial service
by - Monday, Apr. 21, 2003 at 4:41 PM

I'm all for kiss-ins while Fred Phelps is here. He will be at numerous churches and colleges on his blessed little stop in Pittsburgh. But a kiss-in is just not appropriate at ANY memorial service. Imagine being Mr. Rogers' wife or son and remembering his public memorial as Fred Phelps encircled by a bunch of people making out. A much nicer memory would be that everyone knew Phelps was there somewhere, but it was just impossible to tell past all of those people who wanted to remember Mr. Rogers for all that he'd done for children, adults and queers alike. I know I'd much prefer this memory to the former. I fully support diversity of tactics, there's a good chance I'll be at a kiss-in at another Phelps target. But a memorial is no place for any agenda, and that's why I'll be singing at Mr. Rogers' memorial, as much for myself as for the purpose of erasing Fred Phelps from that event.

s.f.b
by whoa Monday, Apr. 21, 2003 at 5:14 PM

i never said kiss in at the memorial. is eveyone trying to find a reason to get nasty?.pffhht.

but
by . Monday, Apr. 21, 2003 at 5:53 PM

i never said kiss in at the memorial.

But this is exactly what is being planned.

Maybe an idea
by Toasted Olive Monday, Apr. 21, 2003 at 7:39 PM

During an event dealing with Matthew Shepard, Phelps and his clan were there in full bigoted force. A group of Matthew's friends got together and they made themselves beautiful angel costumes with large wings. When they arrived at the service, they positioned themselves in front of Phelps. Phelps and the other demonstrators were lost behind the beautiful angels and attention was not drawn to them. Perhaps this is an idea?

to t.o.
by s.f.b Monday, Apr. 21, 2003 at 9:00 PM

i loved that idea when i saw the angels in the movie. i think it is clever and beautiful and powerful.

angels
by . Monday, Apr. 21, 2003 at 10:10 PM

I *LOVE* that idea! I emailed TMC sometime last week about Phelps coming to town, and suggested we make large banners to hold up in front of Phelps to block him and his signs out. The banner could read "MR. ROGERS TAUGHT ALL OF US HOW CRAYONS ARE MADE" or something. Something which really emphasizes the seemingly simple yet beautiful things Mr. Rogers excelled at teaching. For those who don't know the reference I'm making, here's the video:

http://video.pbs.org:8080/ramgen/mr_rogers/crayons_56k.rm

It's one of my strongest memories of his show. Even during my angsty teenage years I would sit and watch this segment with fascination.

Costumes
by Mark Tuesday, Apr. 22, 2003 at 12:19 AM

I think the posters are a good idea, I was thinking that we should get people to dress up in sesame street costumes and hold signs that say "We miss our friend."

also
by Evan N Tuesday, Apr. 22, 2003 at 7:34 AM

a thing to keep in mind - the plan is surround phelps with the large cut-outs of the characters from mr. rogers -- WHY? so the children attending wont see him

the plan is also to drown his noise out with mr. rogers songs. WHY? so the children wont hear him

the entire point is to get in between fred and the children there so they ccan atend mr rogers funeral thing in peace without beign bashed for going there, and i think a makeout block, regardless of whether it is a queer one or a straight one, in any case or form of protest, wouldn't be seen as appropriate in the eyes of he parents taking their kids there. In my opinioons its perfectly fine to do that elsewhere on phelp's tour - but i say lets keep it G rated at this one

There are many ways. . .
by John Tuesday, Apr. 22, 2003 at 12:40 PM
johncihon@yahoo.com

As Mr. Roger's sang "There are many ways to say I love you. . ." For those dying to engage in some sort of PDA at the memorial service in front of Fred Phelps, let me suggest holding hands with your honey. Phelps is deranged enough that it will probably annoy him, and it is not disrespectful to the event taking place.

...
by JonUs Tuesday, Apr. 22, 2003 at 6:52 PM

This person is not a christian.....Please do not look at all christians this way..... disgusting.....

JonUs

To Digital re: more info
by contrarycrow Wednesday, Apr. 23, 2003 at 9:49 PM
contrarycrow@yahoo.com

Hi, the TMC calendar link is not working at the moment (went to their site and calendar page is blank!?! What's up with that?) but I'd really like more information re: specific plans for the memorial. Anyone involved: Could you please post the info or contact link or email me? I'll spread the word...

whats wrong with diversity?
by breeder Friday, Apr. 25, 2003 at 3:07 PM

After reading this entire page full of conflict I see mr Rogers rolling in his grave. I have seen a very diverse range of ideas on how to protest/neutralize Phelp's presence at the memorial service and I can't figure out why people can't take some of Rogers' teachings to heart and be a little bit more open. While I'm not planning on neing in any kiss-in, I can't see any reason why it should make other counter-demonstrators uncomfortable other than that they're really not as "liberal" or "politically correct" as they pretend to be and think that homosexuals making out or anybody making out in public is somehow improper immoral or sinful. Is there something about kissing that corrupts young children? We'd all better watch out then and not just shove the queers in the closet, god forbid children should catch somebody kissing and turn down the path to hell. Sure, it's a memorial service and maybe inappropriate to do something very reactionary, like attack Phelps, but a kiss-in which in my understanding is more about celebration than anything agressive can't go wrong in my eyes.

-Breeder for equality

whats wrong with diversity?
by breeder Friday, Apr. 25, 2003 at 3:08 PM

I need bodies!
by agentPaprika Tuesday, Apr. 29, 2003 at 8:39 PM
agentPaprika@hotmail.com

Ok people,
I think the important thing to remember about this protest against Mr. Rogers and Chatham College is that is being done by people who *want* you to come and make a scene. I think the idea of singing, dancing, kissing, etc. are all fantasitic ideas normally, especially at Chatham. However, I know that I would probably feel a little bad about disrupting Mr. Rogers' memorial service with potentially explosive demonstration. I plan on bringing quite a few VERY large signs (including many heart shaped signs stating "Mr. Rogers loves you, too.") and very large banners. If we enclose the protesters, they really don't have much of a message. If no one can see the day-go "Fred Rogers in Hell" (no joke, they'll be bringing that one) signs, well, then... I guess they might had well not bother even showing up.

I need help! I need sign-holders! Especially BIG people :)
And mix tapes of dance music. VERY happy fun LOUD dance music. I have, consequently, organized quite a few dancers, but more always help. I'll be out flyering on Thursday and Friday (I'm in Detroit right now), but if anyone wanted to get started early, I can email you files to print and copy and pass out, if you'd be so gracious.

I also could use someone with a little knowledge about the organization of a counter-protest... Since the protest has already been granted a permit, do the counter protesters legally need another? I don't want any excuse for this to go poorly.

Also, regardless if you'll be joining in with me or not, please be aware of what you do. Conduct yourselves in a VERY Mr. Rogers-y manner, as the WBC is composed of mainly lawyers with videocameras. They WILL record actions against them and take very real legal actions against whomever they can, no matter how insane or unfounded. They have a habit of harrassing people in the courts, forcing them to incur legal fees to protect themselves against ridiculous claims (Fred Phelps himself was disbarred on both the state and federal level for these practices, but his family can still take action all they want.)

It's going up sometime tomorrow night, but my site surrounding this will be at http://www.mrrogerslovesyoutoo.org anyone will be able to download flyers to print or sign up to "sponsor" the WBC protesters, allowing the community to donate money to the charities of choice of those to be picketed this weekend. I think I'll post the WBC protest schedule, as well, along with where we'll be and when.

Please feel free to email me with comments, etc. I hope to see you there!

-agentPaprika :)

(P.s. Since the WBC will be about 20 people driving in about three or four cars from site to site, would anyone be interested in doing a little critical-mass-esque traffic creation, just to slow them down?)

www.mrrogerslovesyoutoo.org

quick correction...
by agentPaprika Tuesday, Apr. 29, 2003 at 8:56 PM
agentPaprika@hotmail.com

I mean for the loud music, singing and dancing at the college, not ouside the memorial service on Satruday or the church services on Sunday.

Just in case you were wondering.

There will be LOTS of making out at Chatham, so I hear... woo hoo!

www.mrrogerslovesyoutoo.org

breeder
by - Wednesday, Apr. 30, 2003 at 12:30 AM

<i>other than that they're really not as "liberal" or "politically correct" as they pretend to be and think that homosexuals making out or anybody making out in public is somehow improper immoral or sinful.</i>
<p>
It has nothing to do with anyone being gay or straight. It's a matter of respect for Mr. Rogers. If everyone wants to go there and put their sexuality on display at a memorial for a great man who died, fine. They can run around all they want, both gay and straight, and act completely innapproriately for a memorial.
<p>
Or they could help drown out Phelps by ignoring him and his anti-gay agenda and instead focusing on Mr. Rogers. One method puts an agenda before Mr. Rogers, the other puts Mr. Rogers first.

thank you counterprotesters!
by Shelley Sunday, May. 04, 2003 at 4:42 PM
ssross@rocketmail.com 317-357-5735 Indianapolis

I came from Indiana to attend Mr. Rogers' memorial service yesterday. I was completely unprepared for the hateful signs I saw when I arrived. I had expected to cry yesterday, but not for that reason. I am so grateful that you all knew about the protest and worked so hard to outnumber them! Your signs and presence were a great comfort to me and I'm sure to everyone else who attended the service.

I bought a copy of the paper this morning outside my hotel room, fully preparing myself to see those terrible signs again, but was overjoyed to see that the photo accompanying the article was of YOU and YOUR signs. The article mentioned who the protesters were (I was relieved it was crazy Fred Phelps and his like--I had no idea who they were yesterday and feared they were locals) so I did a quick websearch and your site came up. I read some of your messages back and forth as you were formulating a plan for your counterprotest. It is wonderful to see that you all really got together and planned and worked to make it happen. You did Mr. Rogers very proud! You are SPECIAL!
Thank You! Shelley Ross, Indianapolis

LISTEN TO THE SPIRITS
by Danielle Clarke Wednesday, May. 07, 2003 at 5:22 PM
Danielegrl@aol.com

LISTEN TO THE SPIRITS.....HUMAN LIFE IS A DREAM OF THE REAL SPIRITUL WORLD... FROM WHERE WE COME AND WHERE WE ARE GOING BACK TOO!

UNDER OUR GENDER / IDENTIIES
....................Queer.............Q
......................U.....................U..........U
...............transsExual.............E
.........................Straight.............S
..........................T.........................T..........T
..........................bIsexual...............I
............................O..........................O.........0
.....................lesbiaN.......................N
...............................INGay...................ING

OUR SPIRITS LAY
WITH OUT PREJUDICE

hometown.aol.com/danielegrl/myhomepage/profile.html

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